Another chorus of ‘Pot, kettle’
The great thing about religion, you know, is that it teaches people humility.
The Vatican has condemned President Obama’s move to restore US funding for family planning clinics abroad that give advice on or carry out abortions. One Vatican official warned against the “arrogance” of those in power who think they can decide between life and death.
That’s terrific, isn’t it? An ‘official’ of an authoritarian moth-eaten hidebound reactionary gang of priests calls a guy elected in a landslide ‘arrogant’…What does the Vatican ‘official’ think the Vatican is if not arrogant? Humbly obedient to god, no doubt, being conveniently blind to the fact that it’s hard to obey someone who never communicates, and that what the Vatican chooses to pretend is what god commands is actually what the Vatican commands – that the Vatican selects its own laws and then pretends they are god’s laws. It’s a common practice, a familiar con-game, but that doesn’t make it any more acceptable.
And don’t forget the arrogance of the Vatican as ‘those in power who think they can decide between life and death’ by ordering people not to use life-saving condoms during an Aids epidemic.
In an interview published in an Italian newspaper on Saturday, senior Vatican official Monsignor Rino Fisichella urged Mr Obama to listen to all voices in America without “the arrogance of those who, being in power, believe they can decide of life and death.”
Mr Obama does listen to all voices in America, including that of Rick Warren, which I and others consider one voice too many; but really…how obtuse does a senior Vatican official have to be not to realize and keep constantly in mind that he is ‘in power’ and that the Vatican and its officials emphatically ‘believe they can decide of life and death’? Do they never embarrass themselves with this kind of brazen absurdity?
Now, perhaps, people will finally see that the spiritual tyrant in the Vatican is not, as the press so often takes him to be, on the side of everything that is righteous and good.
This just boils my blood. Imagine the arrogance of that tin-pot dictator telling Obama he’s acting arrogantly! When has the pope not acted arrogantly? In particular, this one, who in the name of Christian unity, just lifted its excommunication of a man who claims that the Holocaust is just a tall story. Talk about choosing between life and death! It’s time people noticed that, despite all his garish robes, this man is not wearing anything!!
And some people think he’s infallible!! Good Dog!
I wouldn’t hold your breath about people seeing anything – this kind of stuff just rolls off. Most people don’t bother to remember it, much less draw any conclusions from it – it’s just kind of Vatican noise.
I suppose that’s one reason I made such a point of it in one chapter of DGHW. The Vatican does have an official view of women and it’s not the secular or liberal view and that does matter, it shouldn’t just be taken for granted and ignored.
Ophelia, you dashed my hopes so quickly! Surely, someone will see how wilful and inconsistent this man is. It’s alright to deny 6,000,000 deaths, but you have to show exaggerated and quite honestly sophmorically theatrical agony over a pregnancy that is not brought to term?! How can anyone not see this? How can it not lead to people throwing him out like yesterday’s garbage?
First of all, he has no basis for the claims that he is making (about the culture of death, etc.). Second, the consequences of his position in human suffering are simply unthinkable. And, thirdly, he doesn’t even bother to argue the point. He’s the boss. And no one can see this?!
1. Anyone with pretensions to “infallibility” has no business calling anyone else arrogant.
2. The lifting of the global gag rule is cause for celebration indeed.
“And some people think he’s infallible!!”
Well, it is like this, RC’c believe that Papal infallibility is the dogma in Catholic theology that, by action of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit, you see, works in the body of the Church, as sensus fidei, to ensure that dogmatic teachings proclaimed to be infallible will be received by all Catholics.
The ‘arrogant’ holy spirit has no business directing the pope to suggest that anyone else is arrogant.
Well some people will Eric but most people won’t. The pope has been issued a free pass and most people just don’t bother to notice how horrible Catholic ‘teachings’ are.
Yes, OB, precisely why I withdrew my support for more modest interpretations of religious belief. NO MORE FREE PASSES!
Yes, Marie-Therese, I know. Isn’t that so nice of the holy spirit? (no caps, notice!)
Hear hear.
It would be quite amusing to see Ratzinger try to get elected in an actual secular democratic election. Ha! Yeah right, he’d wow the crowds.
This level of cognitive dissonance beats all. Being, say, the god damn pope and calling other people arrogant, it’s just too much. It’s pitiful. These are ploys of the desperate.
Looking forward to the day that more people see these embarrassing pronouncements for what they are.
“The Vatican does have an official view of women”
And the view, indeed, is that of which ‘is best suited to her’. Ach, so, genau..kkk
Aye, even within the confines of the Vatican – the pope reckons women “are very present in the departments of the Holy See”. Although, the reality is that (up to three years ago, anyway) there were no more than 15 per cent of women.
There are, however, more women than that in the Vatican City as a whole, of course, but they are employed in the more traditional female tasks of cleaning, cooking and clerical work.
But whatever the statistics, the Pope wants to see more of them. He said the Church had to try not to stand in their way but, on the contrary,
“to rejoice when the female element achieves the fully effective place in the Church best suited to her”.
The pope can afford to be arrogant to the wider world at large, inclusive of Obama’s government – as he has women from all over the globe – in the guise of religious nuns and sisters – who will duly, piously, kiss his ring as well as his feet at any given chance and worship him on the high arrogant alters – day in and day out of their lives
At every single mass throughout the world, the pope’s name is mentioned. He does not need to have an effigy created. He is Arrogance incarnate. He does not like competition.
There should be a global gag put on the arrogant pope!
Who needs to listen to his wretched pronouncements, guided by the holy spirit?
The really interesting thing is that the pope and his toadies haven’t even heard of politics! They actually think it’s the holy spirit in action when they elect a pope! I kid you not! It’s got nothing to do with wheelin’ and dealin’. It’s all the gift of the spirit, so that the one who emerges on the top of the heap actually deserves, by god’s judgement, to be there. It makes the mind weep!
But this is something the journalistic toadies, who so conveniently report this man’s every bowel movement, should look into. What credentials does he have? Where did they really come from? Is this a sufficient basis for making pronouncements about global ethics? Are there any signs in his immediate surroundings that his ethics are askew?
Don’t journalists do any of this sort of thing any more?
There was some reporting on it when he was selected, if I remember correctly. The journalists were certainly aware that it was politics, even if the Vat wasn’t – although doesn’t it seem more likely that they just pretend not to know? I mean, the politicking is very open, apparently, so they must know…unless they’re really geniuses of denial. Well we know they’re geniuses of denial, but still…
Re: Election of pope.
“This may well see much more “hard-line” Popes being elected.”
Such as Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger?
http://www.catholic-pages.com/pope/election.asp –
“I elect as supreme Pontiff…”. They then write a name on it, fold it, and then proceed one by one to approach the altar, where a chalice stands with a paten on it.”
Do, note, that the chalice and the paten (which are associated with the holy eucharist) are used to stuff ballot papers into – can someone please tell me where the sacredness is in this practice at all?
This is the very same eucharist that is more important to the church than genocide. It baffles me. One set of rules for the faithful and another for themselves behind secret doors.
On the matter of political election of the pope, many years ago I was in a discussion about the bible and pointed out that it was the result of centuries of selection and editing for motives of often fairly crude real-politik.
Apparently it’s ok, because although people might think they are gaining political advantage, god will guide their thoughts to the correct choice regardless.
And of course it’s futile to ask people how they know that, or to ask how things would look different if they were wrong.
The Vatican would do well to check out its own track record on life and death in Nicaragua – where its no abortion policy was swung in on pure corruption. The resulting horrors must make them sooooo proud.
Well, OB, I don’t know. I’ve been present at the election of bishops, and, despite all the politics in the room, a good number of people manage to convince themselves that it was the holy spirit, after all.
I bow to your far superior inside knowledge, Eric! (The holy spirit works through politics, I suppose – I sent you three boats, etc.)
Yes, OB, no doubt, but when supporters of one candidate bring in priests on stretchers so that they can vote, it seems obvious that someone thinks the holy spirit needs a hand now and again!
Well that’s the three boats, you see!
:- )