Under police investigation
Genevieve Gluck at Reduxx on another comrade:
A woman in Norway is facing criminal charges and a possible prison sentence of up to three years for stating that men can not be lesbians. Tonje Gjevjon, a lesbian artist, was notified on November 17 that she was under police investigation for hate speech over a statement she posted to Facebook.
…
“It’s just as impossible for men to become lesbian as it is for men to become pregnant,” Gjevjon wrote, “Men are men regardless of their sexual fetishes.”
Gjevjon particularly singled-out the actions of prominent Norwegian trans activist, Christine Jentoft – a man who claims to be a lesbian mother, and who currently serves as a representative for the nation’s leading trans activist group, Foreningen FRI.
And who bullies women for not agreeing with him that he’s a woman.
Earlier this year, Jentoft filed criminal charges against Christina Ellingsen, a representative of Women’s Declaration International (WDI) Norway, for stating that men can neither be lesbians nor mothers. As reported by Reduxx in May, a police investigation was launched into Ellingsen’s alleged “transphobia,” and, like Gjevjon, she is facing up to three years in prison if found guilty.
Criminal charges ffs – for saying an obvious truth.
In addition to calling out Jentoft, Gjevjon also turned her attention towards Norwegian politicians who have supported the legislative adoption of “gender identity” at the expense of women’s rights. One such politician, Anette Trettebergstuen of the Labour Party, is the current Minister of Culture and Equality and the only openly lesbian politician Norway’s Parliament.
But the inferior kind of lesbian who isn’t a man.
Gjevjon first began expressing criticism of gender identity ideology, which she calls the “queer patriarchy,” in 2017 after English feminist author Julie Bindel had her invitation to speak at a university revoked over claims of “transphobia.”
Since becoming more vocal with her “gender critical” views, Gjevjon has been blacklisted by Norway’s artistic community – a scene she had previously been flourishing in.
How dare women say that men are not women? What is the world coming to?
One critic, a trans-identified male who uses the name Ingrid Frivold, went so far as to compare Gjevjon to a Holocaust denier in a message he sent to the Haugar Art Museum, saying: “for many trans people this feels as inflammatory as if David Irwing had been asked to speak at the opening of an exhibition about the Holocaust.”
Right. Men who pretend to be men are just like the Jews in Nazi Germany. Just exactly like.
“I was not prepared for the extent of how queer organizations, politicians and activists would demonize a lesbian artist who was not in step. Trans activists contact people I work with, portraying me as hateful and warning against being associated with me,” Gjevjon said.
It’s how they do their “activism.”
This is absurd. But someone has to push this destructive ideology to its logical end, and the logical end of it is imprisonment (in mixed-sex prisons, naturally) of dissenters. Why not Ellingsen and Gjevjon? I bet Norwegian prisons are a lot nicer than elsewhere.
What else will we call Ellingsen and Gjevjon, once they are incarcerated, but political prisoners?
It’s too bad there’s not an international organization that fights for release of political prisoners.
Good grief. I think I have some catching up to do. I started by looking at the first case tried under this paragraph. It went all the way to the supreme court. Their decision arrived on 30 September this year, See HR-2022-1843-A (in Norwegian, but you could try running it through some online translation service).
In this case, it is clear that the accused posted some gravely derogatory comments on the complainant in the case, definitely far beyond what I would consider in good taste. Here I might quote a bit from the decision:
Later on, it is stated that merely stating that the complainant cannot be considered to be a woman may not reach the threshold of a punishable offence. (But note the weasel words “may not” – not an exact translation, but I think it’s accurate.)
I won’t try to translate the actual statements here, as it is difficult to convey their exact flavour in translation. But anyhow, the end sentence was a suspended sentence of fifteen days in prison, with a trial period of two years. Additionally, he was fined approximately 1500 US dollars.
So no, even though this “hate speech” paragraph has an upper limit of three years in prison, I do not think that anyone risks prison in Norway merely for stating that men can’t be lesbians. And certainly not for three years. Stating repeatedly that all trans people, or all Jews, should be exterminated, would qualify for such a sentence under the same paragraph. Hate speech has a very wide range, and punishments will hopefully be scaled accordingly.
Will they treat her imprisonment as an opportunity for re-education?
Is she being made an example for other radical feminists who would otherwise speak up?
The translation on the site gives us:
The defendant had written several derogatory characterisations on Facebook about the aggrieved person, who had changed legal gender from male to female and changed names. Among other things, he had called her a perverted man pig with sick fantasies and wrote that it was incomprehensible that the authorities still allowed her to care for her children. The Supreme Court found that the statements were contrary to section 185 subsection 2 (d) of the Penal Code that prohibits hateful statements about a person’s gender expression or gender identity. It was initially established that the threshold for punishment is the same for all groups protected by section 185 of the Penal Code. Although there is a large space for statements related to gender identity and expression, those in question were highly derogatory and objectively offensive, and therefore punishable. The sentence was suspended imprisonment for 15 days and a fine of NOK 15,000.
It’s certainly very rude to call anyone a perverted man or woman pig, but should it become a crime because it’s very rude about a person’s gender expression or gender identity?
I wonder how often and energetically men in Norway are prosecuted for calling women whores, cunts and the like.
Harald, I agree that saying all [anyones] should be exterminated is a different matter – but is there any reason to think Tonje Gjevjon said that?
This is the problem. Saying “men are not women” gets translated by “activists” to the “all should be exterminated” charge, and it’s a lie. The Big Lie is that terfs are campaigning for the extermination of trans people, and a big lie is exactly what that is.
One of the most peculiar things about the perennial TRA cry of “genocide!” is that only one side of this conflict is actually extinguishing people’s genetic heritage, through castration and sterilization.
If there’s any genocide going on, it’s a genocide by trans activists, on gay and autistic people.
No, there is absolutely no reason to think she said anything of the sort. I brought that up to illustrate what it might take to get a three year sentence. My point being, saying she risks a three year sentence for saying men can’t be lesbians is a vast overstatement of the legal danger she finds herself in. Of course, that she risks any penalty at all is bad enough – I don’t want to trivialise that aspect.
I haven’t really had a chance to see all that she has been saying or writing. My intense facebook/twitter aversion may get in the way of that.
Big lie: Yes, I agree totally. I’d be very surprised if they get the courts to accept the big lie, though. It could be useful if this ends up in the court, where I hope she will be acquitted. It should put a damper on these shenanigans.
Sorry, my previous comment was a response to Ophelia @ #5. Papito’s post just got in between.
Anyway I saw it and understand what you’re saying.
Ophelia æ #4
– or if it is about someone being gay or lesbian? These are not simple questions. Personally, I tend to think of many trans people (but not all, I suppose) as victims of trans ideology. We need somehow to be able to fight trans ideology while at the same time protecting its victims.
Never happened, to my knowledge. We have laws against sex discrimination in the workplace, but you can call anyone whatever you like without legal repercussions, unless it is actual libel, or it runs afoul of § 185 of the penal code, which covers hateful speech related to race or ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation, gender expression or identity, and physical or mental handicaps. So I am free to call a woman a cunt (though I wouldn’t), and she is free to call me a male chauvinist pig (which may or may not contain a kernel of truth).
That sounds huffy, sorry – I mean I saw your @ 7 and now understand your point. Thanks!
Harald – Isn’t it interesting that so many groups of people are protected by § 185 of the penal code but women are not? I find it fascinating.
Good news! The police have dropped the case against Christina Ellingsen!