Guest post: Etiquette for the server-diner relationship
Guest post by Josh Spokes.
As a former waiter of many years from greasy spoons to fine dining, my politics are entirely on the side of the serving class. Wait staff are regularly abused, and a tipping culture is merely cruelty and theft codified.
However, there are certain standards of service that wait staff at any type of restaurant should observe. They are not difficult, they are not demeaning, and when used correctly they make each party’s day nicer and more efficient. I find eating out so annoying anymore—and specifically because of wait staff—I avoid it. Here are the reasons.
1. We are in a customer-vendor relationship. You, “Justin,” are not my friend. That doesn’t mean we have an adversarial relationship, and it doesn’t mean I get to be rude to you. It means professional distance, which you need to learn.
2. Do not ask me “how are we doing?” That’s false and condescending folksiness. It’s like the infantilizing way doctors talk down to old people. A simple, “Good afternoon, how are you” works just fine.
3. When I ask for another cup of coffee (or mayo, or new cutlery, or anything at all), please say something other than “not a problem!” I know it’s not a problem. I understand that it is not an outrageous request, but standard. All you need to say is “Certainly” or “I’ll be back with that in a moment.”
The endless “not a problems” during table service . . eesh.
4. Stop hovering and conspicuously looking at my plate every time I put my fork down. Stop swooping in to pre-bus someone’s plate the minute they stop eating. It’s rude.
5. Do not ask me, “How is that tasting FOR you,” with that queer emphasis on the “for you” part that I’m hearing in almost every server’s voice. I’m not a kindergartener, and you don’t need to make sure Little Higgins likes his special Kids Menu treat [the fact that child menus are universal in the US is a symptom of another problem]. You’re also not my teacher.
6. Don’t ever ask a diner, “are you still working on that?” Seriously. Listen to yourself. See #5 reminding you that you’re serving adults, not pre-schoolers.
Heh. A few years (i.e. about two decades, because the kids were still, well, kids) we were in a local Denny’s, and had a server for whom every request was “Not a problem” . He repeated this (or, even sillier, “That would not be a problem”) after almost every item as we were ordering; it was rather ridiculous. After he’d departed to fill our order, spouse and I remarked to each other at how *very* reassuring it was to know that the kitchen appliances were operational, the staff was on duty, the necessary foodstuffs were in stock, etc, etc….
Very interesting. US tipping culture baffles Australians who often don’t tip when they’re in America. They should, ‘When in Rome’. I recently read an article by an Australian journalist who was having lunch in a New York restaurant with a group of other Australians. Their waitress, on hearing their accents, pointed out that a tip was more or less compulsory. I’m amazed that an American waitress could tell the difference between an Australian and an Austrian accent.
Tipping always has seemed to my generation demeaning and far too reminiscent of slavery. Staff should be paid enough to not need tips as a supplement to their wages.
The first time I visited China, way back in 1981, my luggage to my room by a young lad who couldn’t have been more than 15 or 16 years old. Upon reaching our destination he turned to me and said “It is my duty to inform you, sir, that in the Peoples Republic of China it is illegal to give or receive tips.” He then held out his hand.
“How’s that tasting for you?” drives me up the wall! It’s way too intimate, like the waiter is asking about the inner workings of my mouth and tongue! If they asked, “And is the texture of the food pleasing as it slides down your throat?” I wouldn’t be any more bothered than I am by “How’s that tasting?”
I agree with basically all of this. (“Not a problem” doesn’t really bother me. But the “still working on that” definitely does; and think of what it says about your establishment’s food when the staff implies that eating it is some chore to be performed!)
What’s amazing is that these things are so widespread that I can only assume that many restaurants train their staff specifically to do these things, which in turn suggests that a lot of diners actually like being treated this way! In fact, I have heard that some corporate chains specifically require wait staff to do the “crouch beside the table so you’re at eye level with the diner when you introduce yourself” because some study supposedly shows that customers like it.
Yeah, I think American restaurants are training their staff to do this nonsense. They were when I was in the business, and conversations with wait staff today show it’s still going on. It’s so misguided.
Yes, Screechy Monkey—that “crouch by the table” thing. I was just saying elsewhere I knew a chain restaurant that made their servers seat themselves in the booth with you because it “feels friendly.” Um, no. No, it does not.
I… lost count of the number of ways this post is rankling me, frankly.
An easy, and self-evident one, to start with, though. You address it to the waitstaff–even though you acknowledge in your own comments that you know damned well that the waitstaff is often trained to do so by their management, under instructions from their executives.
So you’re basically telling them that they shouldn’t be doing their job the way the people who sign their meager paychecks tell them to. Yeah, think that one through for a bit.
If you want to try and change this sort of thing, fine–but don’t put the onus on the waitstaff who have literally no say in any of it. Write a letter to the marketing and research executives, letting them know that while their studies and focus groups may indicate a preference for a lot of this faux-friendliness, a significant portion of their customer base is sufficiently annoyed by it to actively stay home.
On top of that, at restaurants where they aren’t specifically trained to do this, many waitstaff will either have heard of those studies, or have at least encountered the preference for this approach in real life–and thus, learned that doing so raises their tips, on average. In that case, you’re suggesting that the waitstaff is responsible for reading your mind and knowing that you’re one of the special snowflakes that prefers a ‘professional distance’. Maybe you should get a t-shirt printed up that will tip them off.
As for #4….
Like it or not, the restaurant is a business. Especially at busy times, the amount of time it takes to turn a table over to the next guest is key. Pre-bussing shaves minutes off of each new customer’s table-wait time, increasing traffic and profits (and also tips), even if it doesn’t actually encourage people to leave sooner, because you’re still able to clear the rest of the table that much faster. Now you’re actively arguing that both the restaurant and the waitstaff should actively cut their incomes so that you feel more relaxed. If you’re not ordering the prime rib with the minimum 25% tip, I doubt the loss of your business is going to cause them to shed a bitter tear.
Freemage@8:
But you said 15 pieces of flair was the minimum. So… more?
Well the waitstaff could stand over him with a stopwatch to make him get out even faster and increase their incomes even more…
…or could they.
Speeding up turnaround time by driving the customers crazy is probably one of those diminishing returns things.
In other words, non-fast food restaurants aim to provide a pleasing experience, and they charge accordingly. Breathing down the customers’ necks isn’t the best way to go about that, so it’s kind of silly to pretend it’s demanding to object to being hustled out.
Or, better, what James said!
Serious, Freemage, your comment is beyond ridiculous, as if the restaurant is there to maximize its profits like a plastic-widget-maker outsourcing its manufacturing to China… um, NO. That’s not the business model here.
If waitstaff is going to hustle me around like they’d rather just strap a feedbag onto my face and prod me towards the exit, then screw that place, and they’d better brace for impact when my Yelp review goes live.
Idea for new restaurant chain: put the punters in a dentist’s chair, recline it all the way, put a funnel in their mouths, pour. Out in 5 minutes. Who wouldn’t want to go there?
It does appear to have rankled you, Freemage. I hope you’re feeling better now.
I’m not saying the rules aren’t ridiculous. I’m not saying that the waitstaff shouldn’t be permitted to find their own way to address customers.
I’m saying that addressing your comments to the waitstaff who has absolutely no choice but to go along with these rules is astoundingly unsympathetic for a former waiter. I’m saying that if you want your voice heard, you should direct it someplace useful.
Remember the “car culture” post? You made a genuinely awesome point there (and when I critiqued the post, I should’ve acknowledged it, for which failure I apologize)–namely, that if you want anything to change, you have to speak up to the people who matter.
Most of the behavior you describe? I’ve never encountered it outside of a specific tier of restaurants–namely, corporate run, standardized national chains that are usually a bit cheaper than their independent counterparts. Denny’s, TGIFridays, Red Lobster, Olive Garden, etc. These places DO run on a business model of pushing through as many customers in an hour as they can manage, because they live and die on marginal profits, just like Wal-Mart and other big box stores do.
The small diner near my place that has a menu of items similar enough to Denny’s to use as a comparison point, but which ends up costing about $5 more per person on a typical breakfast run? Yeah, they don’t do any of it. They even wait to bus the table until I at least give an indication that I want the plate gone.
Similarly, I’ve never had it happen at the handful of high-end places we occasionally save enough up to splurge on. There, I’m paying in part for a relaxed ambience, and I get it.
So if you want this sort of thing to be less of an issue, you’ve got two options. Either work up an actual campaign to petition the corporate offices of the big outfits to change their policies (and seriously, expecting a corporate office to alter behavior that was built off of focus group studies without a hefty campaign is a fool’s errand), or start spending more per meal, and taking the effort to locate little family-run restaurants that let relationships with customers develop organically, rather than operating on a corporate mandate to build brand identity through positive interactions with the customers, making good use of flair.
Being annoyed at, and blaming the waitstaff, just misdirects the ire and puts an onus on them that they can do nothing about.
But we can also kvetch.
Goodness.
If I may kvetch about a different customer relations issue…James Garnett’s reference to Yelp reviews reminded me of the annoying trend I’m seeing of companies badgering me to review them.
My car dealership was the worst: the service reps would explain that they got written up if they didn’t get at least 9 out of 10, so they begged you to answer the surveys and give them all 10s. (This, by the way, made me laugh whenever I would see their commercials bragging about their top-rated service; I knew how they got those ratings!) The company they contracted to conduct the surveys would then keep calling my phone to get me to do the survey. I finally got them to stop calling, so now I only get a half-dozen emails in the weeks after a damn oil change.
And now it seems to be spreading. VRBO wants me to write a review of the vacation home I rented for a weekend. I bought some stuff on Amazon earlier this month, and both Amazon and the sellers are hitting me with emails asking me to review. Grocery store managers order their cashiers to ask me to review them.
I know some people love writing reviews or leaving ratings on Yelp. I just can’t be bothered most of the time, but requests that I do so are becoming an increasingly large portion of my junk email.
Freemage–
“In that case, you’re suggesting that the waitstaff is responsible for reading your mind…”
This is the feeling I always walk away with from reading internet complaint threads or Yelp reviews about waitstaff. Joe Schmoe will complain about waiters bringing the food out and then ignoring them until the check is dropped off, and Joe Blow will complain about waiters who “hover” and bother him without waiting to be flagged down. Jill Sixpack says waiters are too familiar and friendly, and Jane Lunchpail says they’re too icy and snobby. The staff are in a no-win situation.
I have to agree with Freemage on this: the wait staff at chain restaurants is not allowed to NOT follow the corporate guidelines, and they can actually get demoted if a “secret shopper” report says they didn’t refill the water glass within 3 seconds or suggest a dessert. Management really doesn’t care if you have a pleasant dinner experience. Sure, kvetching is your right, but the waitstaff is not at fault.
Also, those surveys you are asked to fill out online? If you give less than a five, your server gets demerits. So if the server following management’s rules makes your chain-dining experience unpleasant, an underpaid worker gets screwed again.
Please continue to voice your dissatisfaction on forums where real live servers don’t get blamed, OK?
I’m with Josh on this one…I realize servers have to do what they are told, just like I have to do some really stupid things my boss tells me to do. But I don’t know how difficult it is to buck the trend, because I have gone to some chains and had much better experiences. The waitstaff manages to keep within the bare bones of the guidelines, but they do it without being so annoying.
One of the most annoying things I encounter is the waiter showing up at your table almost the second you get your menu open, pad poised. Are you ready to order, dear? 1. No, because I have no idea what you have on the menu yet. 2. Don’t call me dear. (I certainly don’t think that second one is command, because I only get it from certain perky young waitresses and the occasional older woman). I cannot possibly order my drink before I know what there is to drink, unless I am only ordering water, and I will not order my food until I have some idea what food they serve. But this happens every damn time I go to a restaurant. Once in a while I have experimented with saying, no, I’m not ready yet, Then good luck if I ever see them again.
If I sense that a business wants to rush me in, let me swallow my food in a few gulps, and rush me out so they can plant another butt in my spot, while charging me too much for the food and underpaying the waitstaff, I choose not to return.
Whether this is the problem of the waitstaff or not is irrelevant. This is a problem that has arisen because people…both customers and employees…have become commodities, and people do not matter, only money matters. But to yell at Josh for his post? Please don’t. His post is timely, relevant, and clearly something that most, if not all, of us can relate to. And yes, waitstaff is overworked, underpaid, and underappreciated. Yes, we have to do what our boss tells us to. But we need to stop eating our own, just because they do not meet some standard of perfection in thought, word, and deed. A standard of perfection, by the way, that not everyone agrees is the proper standard.
I don’t know exactly where I was going with this, or how to end it, but I do know that there are much more important things to get upset about then whether Josh addressed his concerns to the top of the pecking order or not. One of the reasons I quit reading comments at Pharyngula and rarely read comments at WHTM is the maddog watchdogs that seem to spend all their time watching comments to pounce on someone who unwittingly says a word or a thought that has been decided by the horde to be unacceptable. I don’t want to see that happen here…this is the only blog where I still read comments, because it is the only one that seems to be populated by groups of intelligent people who can talk to each other without acting like a lot of howler monkeys.
I’ll accept the criticism that my irritation is probably better directed at managers than wait staff.
Some of what annoys, however, seems to me more a cultural/generational thing than a specific management directive. Your mileage will vary, clearly.
Well, blow me down with a feather; somebody accepting fair criticism with grace. And on the internet, too.
Well done, Josh.
To add my two pen’orth (that’s ‘two penny’s worth’, kids :-) ), when the staff are working to a script and living in constant dread of the mystery diner, it would be unfair to blame them rather than the managers or owners.
It was once explained to me that the chains have their staff perform to scripts because the customers like consistancy, they like to know not only how the food will be but how the staff will perform and treat the diners.
Personally, I don’t like the fake friendliness and will, on the rare occasion I venture into a chain restaurant, quietly tell the wait staff attending me that they can, if they wish, drop the scripted stuff and just be themselves. I find most actually appreciate it.
@ 21 iknklast
That’s not by accident. I’ve long admired our host’s approach to comment moderation, which is — rather than to have a set of rules — to curate, or cultivate as one would a garden. Had I a blog, I would aspire to do the same.
(And I say this as someone who has occasionally been in danger of being classified as a weed.) :-)
Why thank you, Silentbob. Also thank you for so thoroughly taking my point the other day. Feel free to include dissents in the mix.
Yes, SilentBob, Ophelia, I wouldn’t want to read the comments here, either, if it were a group that tolerated no dissent. Polite, reasonable dissent is so crucially important; it’s what keeps us from becoming locked in a bubble, to refer to another piece posted on this site.
To my conversational opponents *—-
Did it occur to you that I might be referring to behaviors that I see not in chain restaurants, but also in small, local, totally independent eateries? And that these behaviors crop up in too many disparate places to be explained by “Applebee’s makes them do so”?
Because that is true. I think you would have done well to give me the benefit of the doubt, and I think you should have remembered to at least ask. I don’t expect that most of you will acknowledge this, because it does change the kind of opinion you’d take away from my piece, and that’s probably not something you’re interested in.
But I hope you remember to be a little more charitable in future conversations.
*(Not enemies, just opponents on a topic. That’s OK.)
And after all you did say “from greasy spoons to fine dining” – which surely hints that you’re not talking about chains.
(iknklast @ 26 – the reason I told Sbob to include dissent is because I upbraided him about a week ago for dissenting only, without otherwise participating, so that it came across as lying in wait to pounce on mistakes. Since then he’s been Participating. I was saying he’s allowed to include dissents again!)
My anecdote has ultra-defeating powers, Josh, so just you watch out!!!
Some years ago, my (now)spouse and I went to Graceland for her birthday. While staying in Memphis, we had dinner in a Thai restaurant, where the server, a young woman, was friendly in that Southern manner so remarked upon. She asked us where we were from, why we were there, and then went on to recommend that we visit Graceland Too, something neither of us had heard of. I will not bore the other readers here with a description of that wonderful, wonderful place, but had it not been for her more forward, friendly manner, my enamored and I would never have known about, much less experienced, the rolling dental plate of Mr. Paul MacLeod. The several unforgettable hours we spent in Holly Springs happened only through the near-divine intervention of that friendly young woman who brought me my vegan pad thai. I will also mention that we spent a long time in the history museum of Holly Springs, where we as two Northerners achieved a grasp of segregation that we had never before known.
Chasing ratings is a modern exasperation. It’s bad enough in the hospitality industry – hotels, cafes etc. I’ve had the guide in Pompeii asking us to go to Tripadvisor and give her a good review as it was important for her job. She’d been perfectly fine so no problem doing it but it was demeaning for her – a woman with a good command of English and a friendly manner – to be seeking our approval like that. Now the telephone engineer asks for a good review in case I’m rung up & asked. It distorts what should be normal relations between people. One person is doing their job efficiently and with a friendly manner and you’re interacting in a normal, human way, and then it becomes a relationship of patronage & servility. The assumption in a democratic society is that we’re all doing our jobs competently if we’re binmen, secretaries, guards on trams, bus drivers, and we treat each other civilly – maybe warming to friendliness that shouldn’t be enforced.
I’m especially annoyed that it’s crept into my work. I send documents to the production team, we discuss the requirements of the job, they do it quickly and well, they are nice to engage with & then when they complete the job we are supposed to mark them Excellent, Good etc. So all those pleasantries between colleagues that help humanise the job become salesman-style greasings up, & you wonder if Gerry was being normally friendly or servile? I’d rather a return to total formality than this kind of wank.
Josh:
Fair enough; I should’ve given you the benefit of the doubt on that point, at the very least. That said, I still suspect that it’s management’s doing, and that it was the stuff that started at the chain stores and then spread to smaller eateries that felt the need to emulate the chains in order to compete. I do still feel the original complaint belongs directed at whatever level of management exists where decisions about training and policy get made.
Oh, and on “opponents, not enemies”–agreed, and I should probably be more cautious in making certain that sentiment comes through in my own posts. I know your positions on too many issues to regard you as an enemy.