What Was the Question Again?
I’ve been thinking a good deal about focus lately. About relevance, subject matter, connections. The competing merits of breadth and intensity, range and depth. About how to think about such things, and how to decide between them – metaquestions again. I seem to think about metaquestions a lot – but then that’s not surprising, is it; B&W is essentially about metaquestions. At least I think it is. That’s one of the metaquestions I’ve been thinking about – what is B&W about.
Not that I don’t know, or don’t think I know, or think I don’t know. I do think I know. Or at least I know I have an opinion. But there could be other opinions – and in fact there is at least one other opinion. There are people – one or two at a minimum – who think B&W could have a narrower focus. Who would even prefer it to have a narrower focus – without necessarily going so far as to say it would be better with a narrower focus. Which leads us into some more metaquestions about such things as the difference (if any – that’s a further metaquestion – whether there is a difference) between preferences and moral or aesthetic or epistemological judgments. Between likes and dislikes on the one hand, and moral or cognitive evaluations on the other. Is saying ‘That’s good’ exactly the same as saying ‘I like that’? How do we distinguish between taste and judgment? Much-vexed questions, all of them.
And in a way part of B&W territory – in my view of the matter. But I can see why other views would differ. I think it is (in a way, as I said) because ‘how do we know?’ and ‘how do we distinguish’ questions are background questions for the more specific, local questions that are our brief. But then I take a broad view, and that’s not the only view possible.
Perhaps it’s more accurate to say I take a variety of broad views. Maybe I take a different one at any given moment – no, I’d better not follow that thought up, or we’ll be here all night, and I’ll never get around to saying what I was going to say. What was that, anyway? Something about what kinds of subjects I think are relevant enough to the concerns and interests of B&W that it makes sense to link to them. Something about epistemology, and what a lot of ground it covers – how hard it is to talk about almost anything without getting into it. Along with something about the interest inherent in the way apparently unrelated things actually fit together, and the thought that what B&W lacks in focus it makes up in range and breadth and interestingness. Or at least that it does to my taste, but that doesn’t mean it does to everyone’s.
But you see the problem. Once I start talking about metaquestions I can’t stop, I start following them as they zip around the room, and pretty soon I’ve got myself tangled up in a horrible knitting-wool snarl of them. Of course that’s not true really – it’s just rhetoric. I could delete and re-write. Leaving the digressions there is part of the point (I have a point? No not really what you’d call a point, just an endlessly-deferred series of approaches to points) – the point being that the subject matter of B&W seems to me to be so large and complicated and branching that a narrower focus would simply leave most of the subject out. But then that depends on how you define the subject.
In fact even the subject of this N&C is too large and branching for one N&C, so I’ll have to do a chapter 2 later.
If you’re asking for reader input here, i must say that i very much like B&W just as it is – after all, you have the “in focus” section for going into greater depth on particular subjects, right?
Speaking of which… are we allowed to make requests? It’s about religion… you have a (wonderful) In-Focus section on “Science & Religion”, but what i think would really top it off would be a complementary In-Focus about Religious assymetry, demands to be immune from criticism, & stuff like that.
You already wrote some great notes on the subject, such as:
<http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com/notesarchive.php?id=289>
and <http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com/notesarchive.php?id=216>
Anyway, it’s just an idea ;)
oops, it deleted the links. lets try that again:
http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com/notesarchive.php?id=216
http://www.butterfliesandwheels.com/notesarchive.php?id=289
I never metaquestion I didn’t like…
Keep the broad focus. It helps people learn to compare crap in 1 field w/ crap in another. Also to compare non-crap.
Besides, it’s nice to have sites where you never know just what will be waiting for you when you access them in the morn. That cougar article, for instance–not just a nice examination of how civilization can interact with the wilderness, but more questions waiting to be asked. Is the advice (from other sources)to all of us, to not hike alone, more or less valid than the injunction to women to not walk alone in town at night? If some people must hike alone, would wearing a mask on the back of your head, like they do in India, improve your chances? [Not to mention being insured by Smith and Wesson.] Need it be repeated that a habit of awareness is more basic than either of these?
Anyway, don’t change, unless you clone yourself.
Well I’m always asking for reader input. But I suppose that was part of my thought with this Comment, yes. Thinking aloud and wondering what readers thought, both.
Of course, it’s not what you’d call a controlled experiment, is it. People who don’t like B&W don’t read it, so aren’t going to say anything here. But I am very interested to see your *reasons* for liking the broad focus. Comparing crap in one field with crap in another, exactly. (That would make a rather good banner…)
Of course you’re allowed to make requests. Religion In Focus sounds like a good idea. I have plans and notes for several In Focuses, and will get to them eventually. True, that is one place where I actually manage to stick to one topic.
Thanks for the input.
I endorse the request that you stay as sweet as you are.
Speaking about epistemology, I really liked Cassandra Pinnick’s polite but lethal demolition of ‘feminist science’. I know I’m a man (or should I say that I have a tendency to exist at one end of the gender spectrum?) but I’ve never understood how, if scientists had always been women, E would not equal mc2 and sound wouldn’t travel at 760 mph.
Cheers.
Sweet? Me? Oh dear, how can I possibly have conveyed that impression?
But I will stay whatever it is I am here. I’m not contemplating a change (a change from the essential changeability of B&W, its infinite variety which custom never stales, etc), just pondering and musing and taking stock.
Delighted you liked Cassandra Pinnick’s essay. As for E=mc2 – look it up in the Fashionable Dictionary, Irigaray will explain all.
Richard, maybe so, but that’s all the more reason to make the effort, and to be aware of the need to make the effort, wouldn’t you say? And if Midgley said that – I have to differ. That may be true about human judgments of those pure facts – but it’s not true about the facts themselves. There would be facts about the world if humans had never evolved at all; there are facts about the world that we don’t know and never will; they’re none the less facts for that.
To my eyes, B&W is defined by the question “Why won’t the public eat up their nice hairshirt rationalisme?”
Happily, all attempts to actually answer the question are dismissed ex cathedra as defeatiste or mysticisme, so it can run and run.
Really?! That’s a very interesting take. I don’t suppose you’d care to elaborate? I don’t recall ever even so much as using the words defeatist or mysticism, so I’m not sure I understand your point.
B&W is not religious, though, if that’s what you mean. It is an atheist outfit, definitely.
In so far as I consider said question to characterise B&W, I meant a rhetorical form of it like, “_Why_ won’t the children behave!?” rather than an enquiry such as “Why is the sky blue?”
It is surely established to everyone’s satisfaction, or otherwise, that the public mind is a teeming ferment of irrationality. It seems to be your editorial position that it should just jolly well desist from being so.
What B&W most persistently lacks, from my perspective, is the slightest apparent respect for or interest in procedures of enquiry which hold that this approach is about as likely to work in the future as it has in the past, which is not at all. The only time that traditions of philosophy outside the gamut (from A even unto B!) of the Dennet/Grayling spectrum occur is when somebody from within it is huffing and puffing and blowing their house down. (Sometimes with both justice and competence, admittedly.) I wrote in haste, yesterday, and “nonsense” would certainly have been a juster mot than either I actually used.
I am endlessly perplexed by your enthusiasm, which I do not share, for AC “Cracked Record” Grayling’s anti-Freud “classic”, “It’s not Popper science / It’s not proper science!” and Richard “Mememaster” Dawkins interminable dear-choir sermons, in which he undertakes to establish that the only rational basis for epistemological convictions is a concern with emperically testable hypothesis, starting from the simple and surely indisputable assumption that the only rational basis for epistemological convictions is a concern with emperically testable hypotheses. (I am of the opinion that I could do the job in less space than Mr Dawkins, although I might overlook in my haste to insult one or more major world religions and there are certainly those who would consider this to outweigh any advantages of concision.)
In fact I think, personally, that I would myself make an excellent professor of the public understanding of science, in which I would fulfil all reasonable expectations associated with the post by issuing an unvarying annual report reading, in full, “Nope, they still don’t.” And I would do it for substantially less than Mr Dawkins, at that.
Why I keep coming back here, as I would imagine you to be wondering, is that on the whole I like science – science is what I was trained in, and science is in fact what I do for a living, so to some admittedly very oddly-shaped extent I am on your side, in so far as there as sides to be on and I am on one.
But in fact, rereading your comment of the 24th, it seems unlikely that the differences between your Platonic Gradgrindian epistemology and my preferred anarcho-hermeneuticisme (the clever bit, which I probably didn’t invent, is to manufacture such an account which nonetheless acknowledges that science is very good indeed at what it does, which it is) are even interestingly irreconcileable, so I shall endeavour harder to bite my tongue in future.
I am as much at a loss as you must be to imagine how anyone could fail to notice the atheism which the site wears firmly on its sleeve.
des,
You certainly do go in for rhetoric, as you indicate. It would be all the better if tempered with a little clarity, to my way of thinking. And a good deal more concision. In short, I have only a vague idea of what you’re talking about – but perhaps that’s intentional? Since you seem to be saying that we’re too keen on clarity here.
But you run too many things together. For instance what ‘works’ is not necessarily the same as what’s best – depending on how one defines ‘works’ and ‘best,’ of course, but then you don’t define what you mean.
I wonder why you think I’m enthusiastic about a work of A.C. Grayling’s that I’ve never so much as heard of, let alone read.
My comment of the 24th. Hm. I see one for the 23d and one for the 25th but none for the 24th. Slow down, take a deep breath, notice where you’ve omitted words or confused dates, and maybe we’ll see what you’re getting at – otherwise it’s a bit difficult.
Your last sentence is incomprehensible to me. Of course I don’t imagine anyone could fail to notice B&W’s atheism. When or where did I ever say I did?
At any rate. You’re right that we obviously have opposite ways of thinking. But I still think you’d make a better case for your way if you wrote a good deal more carefully and clearly.
“””
My comment of the 24th. Hm. I see one for the 23d and one for the 25th but none for the 24th. Slow down, take a deep breath, notice where you’ve omitted words or confused dates, and maybe we’ll see what you’re getting at – otherwise it’s a bit difficult.
“””
[from | OB | 2004-01-29 – 16:25:37 |]
Perhaps we are using different definitions of 24. This often leads to confusion. I was referring to this:
“””
There would be facts about the world if humans had never evolved at all; there are facts about the world that we don’t know and never will; they’re none the less facts for that.
| OB | 2004-01-24 – 17:34:15 |
“””
“””
Your last sentence is incomprehensible to me. Of course I don’t imagine anyone could fail to notice B&W’s atheism. When or where did I ever say I did?
“””
In which case, I have even less idea what you could possibly have meant by:
“””
B&W is not religious, though, if that’s what you mean. It is an atheist outfit, definitely.
| OB | 2004-01-28 – 17:37:48 |
“””
Oh, I see. No, the problem is the definition of ‘comment’ – I thought you were referring to a N&C.
So you think that not only our opinions and judgments about facts, but the facts themselves, are a human artifact? You’re an Idealist then?
You’ve completely lost me with the last bit. Yes, B&W is atheist; no, it’s not religious. If you have no idea what I meant by that – I have no idea how to make it any clearer.
On nomenclature:
I assumed it would be uncontroversial to call the individual top level entries on N&C “posts” (if necessary, which it wasn’t) and the comments, um, “comments” in keeping with established blog tradition. What do you call what I call comments?
On idealism and epistemology:
I’m a phenomenologist, which means that I do not accept that the logial priority of either the world or the self, since they are never experienced separately. Phenomenology, from Husserl onwards, explicitly rejects the Realist/Idealist dilemma. There is a long tradition of Anglophone philosophers getting cross about this, and a just as long tradition of Continental philosophers doing it anyway.
However, even a classical logical positivist would be forced to reject the idea of facts that were true in a world without sentient beings. (That’s a slight strengthening of “There would be facts about the world if humans had never evolved at all.” since you didn’t rule out evolution of any sentient beings, but I hope it’s still in the spirit of your claim.)
Consider the slogan, “The truth of a statement is its means of verification” (I am eliding a distiction between “true statement” and “fact” here which I again hope you will not reject as distorting your intent.” How is a fact “verified” when there are no possible verifiers? What can “verification” possibly mean in such a scenario?
A distinction perhaps could be made between true _in_ such a world and true _of_ such a world, the latter to be determined by purely logical extrapolation from the properties of worlds in which we can verify things, but that would reintroduce precisely the element of “true _for somebody_” which I took you to be rejecting.
On clarity and atheism:
In an attempt to demonstrate such capacity for clarity as I have, I shall see if I can clarify this point. I understood content of the first and second statements that B&W is atheist and not religious. What I failed and fail to understand is what purpose you might have for making such an explicit comment.
Take the first comment: “B&W is not religious, though, if that’s what you mean. It is an atheist outfit, definitely.”
If you meant this to be read other than as a suggestion that there was a possibility of doubting that I had noticed this to be the case, I am at a loss to interpret it and would certainly appreciate guidance.
But then the second comment, “Of course I don’t imagine anyone could fail to notice B&W’s atheism.” is at odds with this interpretation of the first comment.
Is it clear now what I find unclear? I don’t think I can make it any clearer…
No controversy on ‘comment’; I just didn’t understand, that’s all.
I must need to keep the distinction between fact and true statement, because I take facts to be independent of statements.
Thanks for the elaboration.